Do you want to achieve perfect cycling form on the bike? Today we're going to break down exactly why Pagacha looks so effortless on the bike. Yes, sure, some of it is genetics, but a lot of it we can deconstruct and we can build it into our own training, and that's our goal for today.
Anthony, let's crack straight into the questions. I've been told my upper body moves too much when I ride. How do I develop that still and efficient pro look without feeling like I'm stiff as a board?
When we talk about the professional look, there is no more professional a look than Pagacha. So I had a little bit of time on my hands and I researched to try and figure out and deconstruct exactly what makes Pagacha. We're not talking about his physiology.
We're talking about aesthetically how he positions on the bike because we can copy that when we can't copy the Pagatcha physiology. Unfortunately, body position and aerodynamics is the first way I've decided to look at it. Pagatcha is quite arrow but still relaxed posture.
Like his back is flat, but it's not excessively hunched. This means he's aerodynamically efficient without compromising power output because the more aerodynamic you get, you close off that hip flexor angle and you can start to compromise your power. So, he's found a real happy medium that will have been playing around the wind tunnel.
But I recorded a time trial course with David Miller a good few years ago now, probably seven, eight years ago. And one of the lessons I remember from it was David Miller saying all his years in the wind tunnel that if you're to go outside the wind tunnel and look at somebody and if they look fast, they normally are fast when you analyze them. So you can start to tweak your own position and aim for that kind of paga arrow position.
Like take the picture of them and try and mimic it yourself. And if it looks arrow, the chances are if you're going test it, it would be arrow. His elbow bend and shoulder relaxation is another one.
He keeps his elbow slightly bent. This is absorbing all the road vibrations and it's allowing for small micro adjustments for him to balance like with wind corner in the bunch like his shoulders aren't overly tense. That means he's preventing wasted energy.
You see especially newbies and everything's locked out and they feel and look kind of rattly. His hip angles open to generate power without restricting his breathing and closing off his diaphragm. Then we move into pedal stroke.
If you're to look at his pedal stroke, he definitely doesn't mash on the pedals. He's not a masher. He's quite a rounded pedal stroke guy, which means we have even power distribution.
He's not neglecting that upstroke. So, his form, it's maximizing power to the 360 degrees, bringing in quads, hamstrings, and calves into every pedal stroke. His cadence is in that 85 to 100 range, which just looks way more fluid than some of the harder pedlers.
Like without picking on Mads Patterson, I always think he just feels like he's quite a mashy stompy pedal stroke. And then looking at footage of Pagacha, so much of it is footage on YouTube of him climbing, attacking when he's climbing. And he strikes a good balance between seated and standing.
When he's climbing, he switches between the two of them almost effortlessly. He uses that standing attack strategically to get a gap without being he knows there's an aerodynamic penalty for it. So as soon as he establishes a gap, he's typically back into a more aerodynamic position without too much wasted energy.
His breathing is interesting as well. He rarely lets himself go, you know, hyperventilating. It always seems quite, and you need to slow this down and watch it on 0.
5 speed to nearly appreciate it. It always looks quite slow, nasal breathing, deep controlled, rhythmic, no wild upper body movements either, which means he's rarely in oxygen debt. One of the key things that Pagatcha has that a lot of us as amateurs don't have, it's well-rounded adaptation to what we're doing through strength and conditioning.
I'd imagine he's doing a lot of off the bike core strength and conditioning, stuff like that. like his body is lean but muscular in those key areas like glutes, quads, core, giving him that that steadiness and that sustainability to keep that steadiness far into the race. And yeah, that's kind of my analysis of Pagatcha that it took me 60 seconds to get out, but that took me hours to figure out and watching footage of Pagacha.
And look, maybe I missed loads of stuff there. So, let me know in the comments what I missed there because look, your analysis of Pagacha is equally as valid as mine. I think as well, look, this uh listener has basically been told that his upper body moves too much.
And that's really cool that you have somebody to say that to you, right? Because it's very difficult when you're on the bike. When I'm on the bike, and I know plenty of people are like this, I kind of feel like I look okay or I'm dialed in or I'm in the right place in the shop window.
You got to look in the shop window. We all do that. But it is good to have somebody to help you, right?
To look at your form or to maybe set up your camera and cycle past it a few times and see, do you look good? And this is literally just like watch the good lads and see what they're doing. Now, it's kind of hard to unpick.
You've done a good job because I would look at Paga and I'd be like, that looks so cool. The other person that I love watching on the bike is Machi Vanderpole. Don't know how many bikes he sold for his sponsor because he just makes it look so effortless, so cool.
But it is hard as a newbie to look at Pagacha Vanderpole and be like, "Oh, that's what they're doing, right? Or this is the position or that's why it looks so smooth." So that's really cool that you pointed.
Well, I never heard an analysis of it. It's hard to even know where to begin to ground that conversation. And that was nearly my goal with this is to like start a dialogue around it.
Obviously, bike fit every default to that answer, but it's quite a lazy answer because it, you know, it doesn't take in everything that we talked about there. Also, I think the like anecdotally since we launched our strength conditional plan, plug for that because the link is down below. Since we launched our strength conditional plan for cyclists, I've had firsthand experience seeing the transformation people have made in their stability over like six to 12 week period and aesthetically they look very very different on the bike with some SNC work and that's why I think that kind of muscular in key areas is very important.
Okay. Yes, we will see Baga and those other riders at the end of a race sometimes if they're, you know, really suffering that the form does go. You can see a little bit of sway in the shoulders.
Give him a break. But it's very rarely. I think he looks as amazing on the bike at the end of the race as he does at the beginning.
And that's just again his, as you said, strength and conditioning, that endurance, that big engine that he's built up. But also, I will say it's going to be very difficult to look like Pagacha on the bike. He looks like the bike is kind of an extension of his body, you know?
You can kind of see that with certain riders. They just look really cool on the bike. He's been riding his bike since he was very young.
Is Pagache in this like very since he was a kid? I don't know what age he started, but yeah. Yeah.
So, it's it's it's definitely something to kind of consider, but yeah, something very difficult I think to achieve. Okay, next question. Anthony, Milan San Ramo is coming up at the weekend.
The real start to the season. I can't wait. What was your favorite ever Milan San Ramo victory?
I loved 2008. Milan San Ramo. First off, it's what a race.
It's really is the start of the spring classics. La Prima Vera, the start of the spring classic season and it just builds to this perfect crescendo over the Chesso into the Pio and you know, you only really need to tune in for the last 30 km and you get all the drama which is brilliant. 2008 Fabian Canelara was brilliant.
They came over in a small group over the Pio and Canelara just hit them and it was a vintage Canelara win. That's like my best memory of watching Milan San Ramo but like watching footage as an Irish person kind of romantic about 1992 Sean Kelly's famous descent in Apogeio. So we had Mareno Argentine who was the world champion at the time, top classic specialist.
He attacked as expected on the Pagio, but Kelly put in this mate Molesesque daredevil on the Pio. One of the greatest descents of all time to catch Argentine and to win Milan Ramos. Top off just an amazing palaras for Kelly.
Yeah, cuz the Pagio is really all about even though it's about 280 km the 300. Oh, 300k. So, the Milan San Ramo is all about the last, as you said, the last kind of 15, 20, 30 kilometers, isn't it?
That fills up slowly. Yeah, it kind of it's like boiling a lobster in cold water and just bringing them slowly to the boil because it just gets gradually harder and harder and harder and you're taking these climbs like Chapressa and Pogio with a lot of fatigue in your legs from a long day in the saddle because I don't think they've got the Pio itself is it's not like those ep epic abdues or anything like that. It's a big climb.
It's a big ring climb. Exactly. But absolutely wearing.
But yeah, I did h see a lot of articles this week just talking about the descent and you kind of summed it up there, you know, talking about Sean Kelly's kamicazi trip down the far end of it that that day to get a win. I can't wait. Morris used the dropper post on this a few years ago.
Oh yeah. Really killed himself. Yeah.
Yeah. Oh my god. I can't watch that footage.
I literally have the cushion up. You played it a couple of weeks ago and I was like I had the cushion in front of my face even though I knew the result. I was like this is just insane.
Who do you think is going to win this year? Much vulnerable. Oh, you heard it here first, folks.
Put your wages on it. Okay, next question. After a trip to Cambriel's in Spain last year and having a nasty spill on a descent, I ended up missing the barrier on a sharp bend and went over the edge.
The bike landed in a tree and I went down to the bottom of a ravine. The rest of the holiday was spent at the pool with broken ribs and a broken wrist. Now I've lost my descending mojo and I need it back.
This year's trip is coming soon and I'm wondering if you have any tips on descending that I can take on board before this year's trip comes. Regards, James. The first part is I absolutely love that this is he's on holiday with the family or something.
He said, "I'm going out for two hours like coffee spin up and down the coast and saloo and he's ended up in a ravine and James's wife has had to like chase after the four kids for the rest of the holiday while he li." Yeah. I don't know.
Actually, James, pop us on our message. Let us know how you got out of the ravine. Uh that is really really scary, isn't it?
That's like that's one of my big fears because when you're going down these descents, those barriers are quite low. It feels very easy to get your line wrong to over. Ah.
Ah. Okay. James, did you hear that?
It's scary. It's very scary. I've never gone over a ravine myself.
We've plenty of clients who've come back from bad crashes and some of them need a surprising amount of coaching to get back to where they're comfortable descending again. Honestly, some people just never get back to that. And that's not a bad thing because maybe you had a, you know, a miscalculated appreciation of just how dangerous cycling is.
And you can go over ravine and you can die cyclist in the Alps. Yeah, that's right. You're lucky to get away with broken rips and a broken wrist.
So, I think you can definitely repair this. It's not a forever case of the yips like you're slicing golf balls for the rest of your life. I don't think that's the case.
I think graded exposure is the first thing I would try. Like start small. Don't force yourself into high-speed technical descents.
You don't want to be going riding sacabra the next day. Fast descent, bunch of hair pins, you know, changing sandy surfaces. Just make it more technical.
You want to find something gentle, familiar if possible at home that you know inside out so you can begin to slowly rebuild your trust. Ride this descent that you know at 40 km an hour. Now ride it at 45, 50, all the way up.
Gradually start building in speed turn after turn, week after week, month after month until it's time to go on your trip. Also analyzing like what happened. Was it something that you got badly wrong?
Is it a mechanical issue that's let you down? So, making sure you're good tires, good brakes, well tuned bike is going to give you a lot of confidence. And then understanding the crash.
A lot of times we crash because we look where we don't want to go. Your bike will go wherever you look. And I remember really early.
It was my first Ross and I'd made a split on a cat one climb and there was like 12 of us left coming down Healey Pass and I didn't know any of these guys but they were all rock stars and my what would become one of my future directors Timmy Barry at Aqua Blue looked around didn't know me and he's like well kid look where you want to go not where you don't want to go and I was like that was such amazing advice it was the first time I ever heard it and then when I moved into track teams you start hearing it look where you want to go look at the black line out through the corner don't look up in the seats cuz if you're looking up in the seats, you're going to end up in the seats. So, I think that's a good one. Another one is you got to be relaxed when you come back because the more tension you have, the more worried you are about it.
You're going to overgrip. You're going to overbreak. You're going to be like we talked about with Pagacha, he's relaxed.
He's bends in his elbows. They're like shock absorbers. Everything's like it's chill.
Tension is bad because it's just really results in bad boy bike handling. I think for me it would be also like when you go back to your tra your holiday, you're cycling all day and you're going down these descents. Yes, of course you want to get your mojo back, but also don't have an ego just because the lads are g going down the climb and taking every corner like crazy and they've got, you know, they've got the access right, they're leaning right over on their bikes.
If you're feeling nervous, if you feel like you're going too fast, if you feel like you're out of control, if you're getting a flashback, just press your brakes. Like, you don't have to go down that descent at It's fun though. It is fun, but it's not fun when you're in that head space and you're worried.
I've tried to follow you a million times going down descents and I'm just like, why am I doing this? I feel absolutely out of control. I'm stressed out.
My heart rate is super high and things can go really bad for me here because I I don't know what I'm doing. So try keep your ego in check and slow as you said slowly build back up to it. No one is going to mind if you're with a group of other cyclists if this is a you know uh going with uh your club or whatever.
No one's going to mind waiting for 90 seconds at the bottom bottom of the descent for you. So that would be my advice. Just leave your ego at home and hopefully you'll feel better as the week progresses.
A couple more I would throw out on the equipment one. Look at what tires you're using and don't prioritize puncture resistance on tires. Prioritize grip on tires and go as wide as your clearance allows on your bike.
If you can get 25s on your bike, brilliant. If you can get 28s on your bike, brilliant. Go with a tire that has really good grip like a Continental GP 5000, the new what's it like the S version with the black chili compound.
Super grippy. Something like that. And then also the breaking in the corners, especially when someone's new coming back.
Like you don't want to break in the corner. You want to break before the corner. You don't want to be breaking mid turn because it's really bad.
And break progressively as well where you're breaking like gentle at first into the corner and then you're trying to understand it's the speed you come out of the corner matters, not the speed you go into the corner. So your front brake is going to control your speed and your rear brake is going to control your stability through the corner. So, you're trying to apply them both, but before you get there, so you can glide through the apex and carry speed out the corner.
Doesn't need to be crazy speed. As we said, gradual progression, but I think your advice was good as well. Yeah, I just to kind of reiterate what you said about your kit, your tires, your pressure.
I know I was chatting to a friend of mine, Miles, who is a cyclist, and he was saying that um in order to get over the yips, it's really, really good advice to geek out on exactly what you were saying, your tires. go and like really understand what makes a good tire, what's the perfect fit, what's the perfect pressure. That will give you a little bit of confidence because you take control over that rather than just dumping dumping it into the bike shop and be like, "Oh, can you just put tires on this?
" Take ownership of it. Also, use our tire pressure calculator on our website. Absolutely.
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Okay, next question. Last Sunday here in Boulder, Colorado, I got dropped in my first group ride with a large group. This ride was the pinnacle of the weekend since getting my new road bike earlier that week.
As a newbie, it's easy to think the machinery makes the cyclist. Instead, I got a dose of reality. But rather than sulk, I continued on my own solo ride.
The destination and goal is to do this group spin again and don't get effing dropped. I now do two training rides solo in the week, 80 RPMs in zone 2 or three, 15 to 20 miles, then a weekend ride of 14 miles in a similar pace. Question to the podcast on big group spins.
How should newbies think about group rides? What's the best approach to building cycling fitness and keeping keeping confidence, especially when there's a mix of experience and it's a fit group keen on pushing a tough pace? And that's from Curtis B.
Well, good the good news is Curtis, getting dropped in your first group ride, it's a right of passage in cycle. I wouldn't say it's a failure. The fact that you didn't sulk and you've set a goal to come back stronger, it speaks volumes about your attitude, which like a can do attitude.
So that mindset is going to make you a better bike rider ultimately. I think understanding where you are. Like you said, there's a mix of experienced fit guys in the group.
Like if you look at our group, right, we've everybody from uh a new French lad came out at the weekend who's he's has like weight loss goals. He's lost like 25 kilograms since June, which is absolutely amazing. Shout out to him for that.
but he's on this journey to use cycling as a tool to recapture his health versus we have some very good cat ones in the group. So, everyone's in together and that's that group is paralleled and it's mirrored in groups all over the world. You've people who are total beginners versus very experienced.
So, you need to understand that as a total newbie into the group, you need to find your place in that group. You're not going to be the fastest guy. You're going to be the guy that's getting dropped.
So accepting that and calibrating your expectations around that is a good place to start. Also understand that even if you're coming like as a crossover athlete, you're coming from high level running, high level rowing, group rides aren't just about fitness. They're almost like a little mini bike race.
They're about positioning. They're about efficiency. They're about pacing.
They're about understanding the etiquette. So even strong riders can struggle in a fast group if they're not used to the dynamics of it. And it is okay to struggle in these groups because you're there to get a workout.
So tips for Curtis on not getting dropped. Keep showing up and you're going to build that awareness of how the group works, the dynamic, how you skip turns. You got very good at skipping turns on our group.
But you figure it out out of necessity. You're like at the start there's this almost like you feel like this is what you have to do. I have to ride through.
And then you go, well, actually that makes no sense because I'm going to ride through and then everyone's going to be waiting for me now. I'm better off sitting on the back, especially into a headwind, especially finding the shelter in a crosswind. You've started to understand this stuff and you get deeper and deeper into the group spin until one day you can hold on.
Yeah, I know. I'm still waiting for that day. It's going to happen.
It's going to happen eventually. And but the biggest thing I would jump on here is and of course if you want to drop us a message, you know, something we can help out with, it's the training around the group ride. It has to be right.
So he's doing two rides per week, 80 RPM. It's not super low, but it is on the low end of what you would want for a cadence. But if you're only training zone two and zone three for a 15 to 20 mile spin, you're only getting the adaptations associated with riding in zone two and zone three.
So you're going and you're said you're doing similar training at the weekend. So you've narrow adaptations like starting to utilize fat as a fuel source in zone two build mitochondria density and amount of mitochondria. So you have these adaptations you get in zone two.
You have a similar set of adaptations but slightly different in zone three. Now you jump into the weekend group ride, you're definitely going to call on those adaptations. So you're building zone two and zone three, but now you're being asked to sprint at a thousand watts out of a corner, which you've never trained, a zone six efforts, you're asked to do V2, zone 5 efforts.
You're asked to be spend long times at threshold, which you've never done before. So you need to build a training plan which has progressive overload built into it, which is taxing all the different systems, and which is goal orientated. So, if your goal is to get around a group ride, let's reverse engineer the demands of what it takes to get around a group ride, the amount of V2 max work, the amount of sprint work we need, and now build a training plan, which is going to take you to that goal.
Some of the recent content we've put out would be super helpful to start watching like the build your own training plan in seven days or to build your own training plan in 30 days or else pop us a message. But I think training and showing up every week are the two main things. Yeah, I as somebody who who has been in this situation, Curtis, just keep showing up.
I always just say, don't so your ride is on a Saturday or Sunday, don't stop going and say, you know what, I'm going to have two months worth of training and then I'm going to go back to the the Saturday spin because that I'll be stronger, I'll be better, I'll be more comfortable, I won't get dropped. The key is and I absolutely love as you said Anthony love your attitude Curtis just show up every day if you're really struggling and you don't mind having a solar ride do that I think it's on you know the people to be responsible know the route and uh keep going yeah I just think it's not going to happen either in two or three weeks try and be patient with it don't get disheartened and look as I said keep showing up okay next question hi Anthony I saw on your podcast, a young cyclist with a higher thanex expected heart rate. It made me think you might be able to help me with the opposite issue.
I'm 62 and have been racing mostly gravel for 10 years and for the previous two seasons have been training for long races, Unbound 200 and a few smaller ultras. I started taking statins and a cholesterol absorption inhibitor last year and over the same period have seen my high-end heart rate from racing and hard training decline from low 180s to high 160s. My zone 2 pace seems to have shifted from 130 to the 120s and even below based onp breathing and talking levels.
Could this big shift be due to extreme increases in fitness with my higher volume? Could it be the statins? I can't find any side effects to that effect, normal aging, or something else?
My coach and physician have no clues? And finally, can max heart rate or increasing my max be influenced by training? Cheers, Bill.
It's a good question. Uh, I'm not a doctor. Nope, definitely not.
So, I will give you the benefit of my experience. I've had some clients with similar issues and ultimately, you know, playing around with statins, changing it, changing dosages, that's something to go to your physician with. If you're not happy with the physician, change physician.
But all that kind of legal disclaimer uh being said, I think high volume training, it can lead to lower heart rates, suppressed heart rates across all zones. But a drop a drop in your max heart rate going from 180 to 160 that's more significant than we typically expect from endurance training. I know for me my zone 2 like I'll be cruising around at like 105 beats per minute at 220 230 watts when I'm fit.
It's probably taking me 130 beats per minute when I'm not fit for the same type of power. So it does get a little bit suppressed when you're fit. well ch well well-trained especially when he's doing unbound like well-trained ultra ultra endurance type athletes they do have lower resting and submaximum heart rates but typically their max heart rate remains stable so just because you get a suppression of the other zones doesn't mean you really get a suppression of that top end the zone 2 heart rate shifting downwards is normal if your stroke volume that's the amount of blood per heartbeat has increased with training meaning your heart doesn't need to work as hard for the same power output anymore.
That's why I've gone from 130 to 105 in my example. However, fitness alone shouldn't reduce your max heart rate by 15 to 20 beats, especially if your perceived effort at max still feels the same. So, that's kind of the let's draw a ring fence around that and that's the improvements based off fitness that we'd expect.
Now, let's talk a little bit about the statins or cholesterol cholesterol, what is it called? Absorption inhibitors. That's a mouthful.
Statins aren't widely known to lower your max heart rate. There's some evidence suggesting they can impact muscle function and recovery. Statins have an effect on muscle contraction.
So, some endurance athletes on statins are reporting induced exercise tolerance, leg fatigue, and hitting the wall sooner. This is thought to be due to mitochondrial function being impacted. There is other evidence and studies to show that they reduce heart rate variability, making it look like you're a little bit more fatigued than you are.
So that could indirectly limit your ability to reach max heart rate is too. But if the heart rate drop coincided exactly with starting your statins, I think it's worth discussing it with your doctor whether a different dosage or an alternate brand might change this situation for you. Max heart rate is affected by edge for sure.
Like he flagged that right at the end of his question, but it's not likely that it's affected this much all at once. It's like a gradual decay, like a muscle atrophy almost. Like max heart rate typically drops 3 to five beats per decade.
So dropping 15 to 20 BPM in a single year, like that's quite a drastic reduction. Some of this it definitely could be due to normal aging, but given that you're actively racing, you're training for unbound and you have high training volumes, I would assume a drop this significant, it doesn't really align with expected trends. Yeah, he did does say in the question, I started taking statins and cholesterol absorption inhibitor last year and over the same period.
So basically over the course of a year, he's seen these massive changes in his heart rate. He's also he also said my zone 2 pace seems to have shifted from 130s to 120s. 130s for a zone 2 seems quite high now for it's very individual.
It's individual. Yeah. Okay.
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Why on earth do some women wear makeup while cycling? I'm out here suffering. Can you read tone into questions?
Yeah. Can you tell I'm disgusted? I'm out here suffering.
Sweat pouring down my face, barely holding on to the wheel in a chain gang. And meanwhile, there's someone in the group with a full face of makeup like they just stepped out of a beauty salon. I mean, what is the point?
We're here to ride, not take selfies. Doesn't it just melt off? Are they really that worried about how they look when they're training?
Or is this just another case of Instagram culture creeping into the sport? Someone please make this make sense. This is a question for me.
Yeah. What do you think? H makeup has no place on a bike.
I just want to wind you up. I think not everybody wears makeup for others. Some people just wear makeup because they feel a little bit more put together.
They feel a little bit more confident. And if makeup makes them feel better, like why not? Isn't the whole point of going cycling to feel good and enjoy the ride?
Yeah. It's funny, isn't it? from like that comes through.
First of all, why do you care so much? Like how is this affecting you? What's your problem?
Like why have you got a chip on your shoulder? Why do you hate a woman wanting to make herself feel better when she goes out in the group spin? Well, it's not much different, is it, than wearing matching kit?
It's exactly. Cycling is quite I don't want to call cycling a vein sport, but we can be quite a vain group in so far as we love to be put together. We like to have It's aesthetically driven.
For sure. It is. It really is.
So, I just don't understand why this person has such a a problem with this. It's Yeah, it's just some I I really I actually when I saw this question coming in, I was like I I think people probably might think this. Would you have if you saw a girl rocking up and she had full beat, full makeup on, you wouldn't judge her.
Look, I'm not sure if it can go I think his question is stupid, but maybe to push back a little bit and give a more moderate version of his question. Can it go too far? Like in the gym?
Like where's the line between going to a nightclub and like if a girl is half-dressed wearing full makeup in the gym to the point that it's making other gym users feel uncomfortable? But how can that make somebody uncomfortable? I I just think if a girl wants to wear a sports bra and a pair of shorts in the gym and a full makeup and she has her hair extensions in, why not?
anybody else. It naturally attracts the male gaze. Like you're going to be just oh my god.
And then that's when it can result in like we've seen this like Tik Tok and Instagram shaming culture where like oh what are you looking at? Mind your own business. It's like what am I meant to look at my feet when I'm walking along like I'm just looking up to see where I'm going.
You happen to be in my I think if someone is in your like line of sight it's okay. But I think if you're if there's people like ogling her then they they definitely need to take a step back and look at their own behavior. I just think everybody once they're not harming anybody else or it's not completely obscene where you're having to cover kids eyes over just wear what you want.
Same on the bike, go for it. Like it's I I I'm absolutely disgusted at this fell's question. Why do you care so much?
It's There's a comedian. I'm not sure who this was talking about it. might have been Frankie Bole, but he's like wondering why it's okay for women to selectively expose themselves but not for men.
Like what if we had like a see-through crotchless shorts that just expose the sides of your genitals? It's a good point, but you lost me at Frankie Box. I think we'll park it there.
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